Chaveirim Damaged the Car, Whats the Right thing to do?

I’m not a rav (far from it), but for the sake of a halacha discussion, here are a few points an thoughts:

First of all, even in a case where the mazik is completely responsible, e.g. someone deliberately kicked your car for no reason, the liability is only for the depreciation in value. Unlike secular law and insurance, the liability isn’t what it would cost to return your car to its previous condition, but only what its drop in value is. An already old and battered car likely has a minimal depreciation from a single additional dent.

Next, I think this question should’ve been asked to a rav and/or posek, because while this wasn’t your intention at all, it may be loshon hora about Chaveirim on this public site.

Third, I do think that the fact that it was Chaveirim is very much a factor – while a random person who comes to help you may or may not be competent, it’s reasonable to assume that a member of a group that specializes in this type of help will be competent, removing the “Why did you trust him?” question from the equation.

Fourth, my family members have been the recipients of Chaveirim’s incredible chessed multiple times. The fact that total strangers are willing to come out to you, literally get their hands dirty, and help with flat tires, jump starts, lockouts and other issues at any time day or night, all the while refusing any type of pay or even a tip, is just an unbelievable kindness. Often their help is for people who are desperate and have no other recourse to get their car back in action late at night or at other times where other help isn’t readily available or would be terribly expensive. These people are a G-dsend to the desperate and I’d strongly ask that anyone keep that in mind.

A word to the supervisor about better training for that individual – yes, phrased as kindly and appreciatively as possible. Being mochel the damage – also yes, whether or not you’re halachicly obligated to, it seems the mentschlich thing to do.

Call Chaverim and thank them for sending someone over to help your son. For free.

And perhaps, offer to sponsor a course for how to work with tires that are difficult to remove other car emergencies that do not resolve as easily as they usually do when you have to deal with an old jalopy.

When you have someone working for you, you should be liberal with their mistakes. There is also an idea that an expert is not liable for mistaken bad advice. BUT a non-expert is.

In this case, I agree with you that you need to help them know when they are competent – and prevent future damage. Surely, you want to send a friendly message to whoever is in charge of the group.

On another note, an unmarried person shouldn’t be driving, since they aren’t yet fully immersed in the value of life.

I’m a Chaveirim guy (not in Monsey), so here’s my perspective: If your car is kind of old, the wheel was likely rusted on to the rotor. Kicking the edge of it is a regular thing to do in this situation, as is hitting it with the spare tire and sometimes, if none of that works, with a hammer. I’ve occasionally had cases where the tire was so stuck on, we couldn’t get it off and the car had to be towed. Even without rust, wheels are sometimes hard to remove. Missing the tire happens to everyone occasionally, but denting the fender is pretty unusual. Either way, I wouldn’t call any of that supreme incompetence, unless there are more details we don’t know. As to what you should do, there’s a few angles:

1. definitely say something to Chaveirim. They can try to figure out exactly how much of an incompetence vs accident this was. If it’s an incompetence or training issue, I guarantee they want to know about it. If it is just a thing that happens every once in a while, then there’s no harm in telling them.

2. When it comes to asking for compensation, it may be worth looking at the whole story. Your 17 year old son called a volunteer organization for help changing a tire. Sure, it’s not always easy in practice, but almost anyone with a license should be able to do it. Someone who does not get paid for this took time out of his day, a week before pesach (so he’s either taking time out of his bein hazmanim, his work, or helping his family prepare for yom tov) to help your son. Even if you want to say the guy didn’t handle it the best, at the end of the day he was trying to help, not getting paid, and dealing with a situation that can sometimes be tricky (wheels do get stuck) in what sounds to me like a pretty normal way. The damage you described also sounds more cosmetic.

Bottom line, you may still be fully within your rights to ask for compensation. After all, the guy did damage your car. But in this case, with the money coming from tzedakah, is it the erlich thing to do? I am biased, but I don’t think so. This is assuming that the damage is cosmetic and your son is physically capable of changing a tire, if those 2 assumptions are not true than things may be different.

Holding someone liable for a dent in an old car when he took his time to help you from his own day without getting payed no think there are times in life where letting things slide makes sense. Out of appreciation and not to embarrass the guy. This is that time. Only good things and good tidings can come from letting it go this time. It’s the honorable thing to do

Commonsayche hit the nail on the head.

I am sure this can happen in any town, so in the future you can leave “Monsey” out of the question. It makes it look like you have an axe to grind.

> it would be best not to name the town

indeed, it is even worse in less densely Jewish towns. When you see a clearly observant person misbehaving on the road, you likely know the person and it is also weighs more into people’s perception.

When I get my tires replaced, I like to watch. I often see hammers and mallets being swung to get the thing off. Especially when the car is older.
As a spectator, I confirm what NOYB states about tires on multiple occasions of buying and watching my tires get changed.

Chaverim do a great job, but I am just wondering – do people in your area use AAA? It is pretty reliable OOT. Is it not good in-town, or there is moral hazard here – people know that chaverim could help for free, so why buy a service?

their are laws in the usa that protect someone who comes and tries to help you called GOOD SOMARATIAN LAWS

Good Samaritan laws provide legal immunity to individuals who act in good faith to assist someone in an emergency, protecting them from liability for ordinary negligence or unintentional injury. These laws are designed to encourage bystanders to provide help, such as CPR or first aid, without fear of being sued if something goes wrong

BESALEL: Very good post by DWKL1, regarding good sam. laws; so: even if anything else doesn’t count, dina demalchusa dina!