New York City authorities said they will shut down a city bus service run by Orthodox Jews if the group doesn’t stop making women sit at the back of the bus.
New York City’s Department of Transportation spokesman Scott Gastel said the agency’s executive director Anne Koenig has asked the company to respond to the allegations and was waiting to hear back.
“Please be advised that a practice of requiring women to ride in the back … would constitute a direct violation of your franchise agreement and may lead to termination of that agreement,” Koenig wrote.
If such a violation is found, the franchise could be revoked, the DOT said in a statement.
The Private Transportation Corp declined comment.
Mayor Michael Bloomberg told a news conference on Wednesday that if Orthodox Jews want to segregate men and women, they should get their own bus. Segregation is “obviously not permitted” on public buses, Bloomberg said, adding, “Private people: you can have a private bus. Go rent a bus, and do what you want on it.”
Deborah Lauter, director of Civil Rights for the Anti-Defamation League, said in an e-mail to Reuters: “We oppose the practice of gender-segregation on public buses as discriminatory and unlawful. If a community feels it needs gender-segregated buses, then they should not involve the city.”
(Source: Reuters)
28 Responses
Bloomberg is right this is a city bus follow the rules or get your own bus.
Chilul hashem. Bloomberg is right (this time.) You can’t forcefuly enforce halacha on government property.
i dont know why they have to be an official route they do not get government money and the buses look terrible it is none of their business if they want to make their own rules
It’s a private bus and they have a right to do this just as other private bus operators do. They are NOT funded by the city or taxpayers.
Wasn’t the bp/willi bus privatized bout a yr or two ago? I even see the buses fully covered in jewish artwork of Brochos and the like.
I don’t understand.
IS this a “city bus” service? Is it subsidized by the City in any way?
I personally thought it was a privatley owned and operated. Can a governmental agency dictate how to run a private business?
I’m not arguing the merits, I just want to understand.
The Women riding the Wsb BP Bus choose to ride in the back.
Are gender segregated restrooms also “discriminatory and unlawful”?
How silly!
They are not being forced to do anything. As is well known, this is exactly what they want.
If the bus is private, and not receiving any sort of government funding, the operators can probably argue that they have a right to do what they want. If they also want government funding, they lose. It will be an interesting civil rights case.
It might be useful to have some frum women bring a civil rights case ordering the government transit authorities to either prevent male groping of female passengers on their buses and trains, or to provide all female accomodations (as are done in many other countries)
The bus is owned by the City Transit Authority and leased to this group of Chareidi fanatics under a program to serve routes not otherwise meeting ridership criteria. However, they get City subsidies and are clearly subject ot non-discrimination rules. It would be no more acceptable to post “voluntary” signs saying “Misnagdim and other Non-Chassideshe Passengers are encouraged to sit in the back of the bus”. As many other posters have said, this behavior is a distortion of yiddeshkeit and daas torah. Fortunately, there are several groups of young jewish law students who have announced that they will purposely challenge any such “separate seating” rules and make those who seek to engage in such despicable behavior feel like they were “thrown under the bus”.
#7: there have been incidents of women who chose NOT to sit in the bus being ordered to go to the back. It’s not voluntary in that case.
It’s a franchise, and a public accommodation (like a hotel: do you suggest a hotel should be able to say “no Jews allowed?”) serving a route on which anyone can travel.
There are federal statutes that provide for lawsuits against people conspiring to interfere with civil rights. The bus company, and possibly any rabbis decreeing the segregation, could be held liable under Section 1985.
Is it any wonder that countries become hostile towards Jews when we pull garbage like this? Let’s get real here, folks.
They should switch it so that the women ride on the front of the bus, and the men ride in back.
#6, state and local authorities can certainly regulate businesses and do so all the time (banks, insurance companies, etc.). The Federal government can regulate a business which somehow affects interstate or international commerce (how much depends on the winds blowing in the Supreme Court). Thus, a state or local government can issue a regulation preventing private bus services from forcing women to sit in the back just as they can prevent them from forcing Blacks to sit in the back. The propriety of such a regulation is, of course, part of the general dispute between liberals on the one hand and conservatives and libertarians on the other hand.
TO THE EDITOR – an article like this deserves a rebuttal from the other side. Otherwise, the issue is one sided and biased.
Not only does the bus line not receive any public funding but Private Transportation Corporation pays the city for the right to provide a public service. The agreement goes back to at least 1973, and last year the franchise paid the city $22,814 to operate the route, according to the New York City Department of Transportation. Great, the Mayor is seeking to deprive the New York City Department of Transportation of much needed funds just to keep a bunch of left wing progressives happy. Maybe the Mayor can explain that to his constituents.
Dear Editor LOY”T:
BiMechilas Kvodchem.
Instead of merely republishing verbatim an obviously anti-Charedi article from Reuters, you should investigate and do your own reporting.
Respectfully
#16:
It’s a franchise, that serves a PUBLIC route. Anyone can ride that bus. Therefore, it is subject to public accommodation laws.
The bus receives ZERO government money. And they have a Constitutional right, as a private entity, to follow their religious mandate. Anyone trying to deny them this right to segregate, are no better than the local anti-semitic shikurs.
The city can’t do anything, since the bus has no segregation policy. The riders do. The bus driver and the bus company don’t enforce it. The riders do. The riders don’t represent the bus company. The bus company is not responsible for what one rider tells another rider.
#19:
Again, you’re wrong. It’s a public accommodation because it serves a public route. To cry anti-semitism is the absolute height of ignorance.
If you want to run a gender-segregated line, get a charter line. But that’s going to be way more expensive.
The Gothamgazette (website) reported in 2004 that the the private bus companies receive government subsidies. As of 2004, these private companies served 400,000 people a day. The article goes on to discuss the financial arrangements made between the city and the private bus companies. To say that the private bus companies receive zero government money seems to be just plain wrong.
11.
ANY and I mean ANY “jewish” lawyer who would argue this case PRO the city deserves a box seat in G’henim!
#23:
And those who violate dina d’malchusa dina are tzadikim?
Sorry, but this is galus. If the lawsuit happened, they’d deserve it.
None of the stories in the Post or Columbia alleged the driver told anyone to go to the back. It was always some rider.
#25:
Not true. From the NY Post article on the issue:
?That?s reserved for men,? the bus driver told a female Post reporter when asked if she could sit in the front rows.
As a yeshivish, frum lady who has rode on segregated buses (in Eretz Yisroel) it is degrading, impractical and MORE untzniustdik to be told to move to the back. There were times when I boarded the bus with grocery packages, 3 children, one baby, one stroller, and NO, I absolutely refused to walk an extra foot as it was impossible. Where is the kavod habrios in telling women to move to the back?? And of course, a man came over to me to tell me to please move to the back and I said, sorry, “kashe li, ee efshar” and refused to move. My kollel husband fully supported my position. What has this world come to? The bus was empty except for 10 people. The man would not have otherwise thought twice about me, a woman, if not for this whole separate seating meshigas. It actually causes men to obsess over women. It’s more untzniusdik because it causes men to think of women more, and also because it causes women to walk up and down the aisle more. I once tried to get on the 49 aleph (separate) in the front in order to buy a bus card, but a 14 year old boy thought it was in his place to tell me, a grownup in a snood, to go to the back. So, I went on through the back, had to walk THROUGH the men to the front to the driver, then walked BACK THROUGH THE MEN to my seat in the back. Like I said, you get more untznius, lots less kavod habrios, and in the case in this article, more chillul Hashem.
And one more thing – women do NOT support this. We just sigh and go where we’re told. It makes no sense and it’s degrading.
As a frum woman I am so glad for the separation. We don’t have the dirty business that the goyim — who love not having separation have. I don’t have to worry about a man “accidently” bumping into me. Or inadvertently rubbing sholdiers. Or being squashed against men. It keeps everything tznius and separate. Baruch Hashem for our Rabbonim.